Forums - MVC2: Oh my lord, runaway Ironman REALLY ownz Cable... Show all 40 posts from this thread on one page Forums (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/index.php) - Strategy & Tactics (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?forumid=10) -- MVC2: Oh my lord, runaway Ironman REALLY ownz Cable... (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=54051) Posted by Eternal Blue on 02:06:2002 02:10 AM: MVC2: Oh my lord, runaway Ironman REALLY ownz Cable... Seriously, I just discovered the power of IM runaway today. Its funny cause he can build meter pretty well. I usually do sj. up+fierce, AD up/back xx up+fierce xx smart bombs. Its such an effective tactic, I had no idea. Its very good to zone opponents, and especially good to beat Cable. The smart bombs take so long to reach the ground, that if Cable remains in blockstun, you can repeat the tactic, or if he wave dashes under them, you can try to cross him up and start combo, or just block. Even excellent AA's like Cammy and CapCom don't work very well against him. BH is probably the biggest enemy. Anyway, I also wanted to mention that when u use runaway characters like IM, and Doom, u should do a move, THEN Air dash up, because this way, you will air dash all the way to the top, but if u just sj. and then AD up, you will not have max vertical distance, and characters like Cable will reach you with AHVB. Just my 2 cents. Feel free to share your runaway IM strats. Posted by MadHatter on 02:06:2002 02:20 AM: couldnt cable just sj with IM then viper beam him before the first hp? Posted by Eternal Blue on 02:06:2002 02:43 AM: quote: Originally posted by MadHatter couldnt cable just sj with IM then viper beam him before the first hp? Yes. Thats what the guy started doing. But you just adapt. For instance, I caught on to him, and I sj'ed, then prematurely, AD'ed toward him, and hit him with up fierce. Or I would AD down, wait for him to fall down, and sj at the same time, so I would have the upper screen controlled. Posted by TopNotch on 02:06:2002 04:16 AM: Can't Blackheart's AAA counter this? And, what other Iron Man tactics do you have? Posted by Eternal Blue on 02:06:2002 04:30 AM: quote: Originally posted by TopNotch Can't Blackheart's AAA counter this? And, what other Iron Man tactics do you have? Thats why I said BH is #1 enemy. And as for other tactics, I sometimes rush with c. short, c. short, c. rh xx jab unibeam...safe and builds meter. I never do infinite. I can't actually, but I have no use for it. I just build meter for Cable using runaway, or mini-rush! I use IM/Cable/Cammy Posted by Razor on 02:06:2002 06:55 AM: aawww... no mannn Infinite is so tastey! Posted by Combo Master on 02:06:2002 07:27 AM: Yeah, this tactic is BULLSHIT! Someone was using this against me and all he did was jump and throw smart bombs while the timer was at 30 seconds left and waiting until he won by time over. Totally gay! Posted by margalis on 02:06:2002 07:41 AM: Welcome to Marvel Super Heroes. That is exactly how IM beats half the MSH cast. Super jump, then: a: If they do nothing, smart bomb. b: If they jump with you, either: 1: Dash up off top of screen, then smart bomb 2: Down + fierce them, killing their momentum, then smart bomb 3: Air dash down, super jump up as they come down, repeat 4: Dive knee to ground, super jump, repeat Since in MVC2 you can interrupt moves with air dash, I imagine doing a down+fierce, then air dash up would work pretty well in combination. This works really well against people who are fat, slow, or otherwise have trouble avoiding smart bombs. The ideal situation is they super jump up a bit after you, you down+fierce them, then smart bomb so that the smart bombs hit them about as they hit the ground. If they jump at exactly the same time as you, depending on distance dash up, or dash down, or knee down, or whatever. But they shouldn't be jumping exactly with you unless you are getting predictable. More likely they are jumping a bit after you, in which case you can down+fierce them or down+rh or air dash up or whatever. The only problem here is, you aren't doind much damage. If you fall behind you can't rely on this, and if your team doesn't use meter that well it probably isn't a great idea. But if your team does use meter well, do this a bunch, then switch in whoever. I would also imagine that using certain helpers as you hit the ground after a super jump would be decent. Maybe not so much against cable though. Posted by Iceman on 02:06:2002 08:08 AM: E.Blue: You might also like to try using IM's fly/unfly in your SJ smart bombing patterns. If you super jump, throw smart bombs, fly, unfly you will actually beat the smart bombs to the ground. This is really a great thread. I feel IM's infinite is waaaaaaaay overrated. The more I play IM, the more I see he plays a lot like Dr. Doom (funny, my second team lately has been Doom/IronMan/AAA). Honestly, I have a lot more success when I play him as such and not play IM/Psylocke and try for the infinite every chnce I see. Posted by DarthSalamander on 02:06:2002 09:31 AM: From what I have seen of TeamDan (my friend who made the IM vid on www.Clockw0rk.com ), Doom AAA sets up the IM infinite rather well. If someone randomly gets hit by Doom it pops them up for the infinite, and you can sweep into Doom rocks and set it off that( you also have enough time to see if they roll so you dash bash with them). Of course Doom AAA compliments the rest of his game incredibly well. Posted by TrueNewbiePR on 02:06:2002 12:47 PM: ironman always owns cable 100% but if cable has an aaa like cammy or bh or commando u r fucked up u have to thnk fast and anyway its easy to own bh i use im/doom/cyke and pretty much own bh and his other aaa Posted by The Cerebral Assassin on 02:06:2002 03:37 PM: *coughIRONMANTHREADcoughcough* I might as well add my $0.02 while I'm here. Unflying helps IM's keepaway well. Superjumping and throwing Fierces helps out as well because of its good range and startup. These tend to clonk people who attempt to knock you out of the air. Throw Smart Bombs when they're at a good distance from you so can place them in block stun. Don't throw SB whenever you feel like it, your opponent will surely catch on quickly and punish IM for it. I'll add more on this later in the IRON MAN THREAD. Posted by Silent Storm on 02:06:2002 06:24 PM: All this stuff you say about IM owing Cable is not true. This tactic that ya'll are talking about a dude try to do it to me when i played cable. And guess what, i whipped his ass. All a cable player has to do sj after IM comes down and throw a hk grenade to stop him from jumping up and lp psimitars. Or he could keep sj and shooting lp viper beams to make sure he does get that stuff started. Duhhhhhhh. So don't go telling people this tactic, and get their asses blasted, even though it might work against some people, but not against the good Cable players. I'm sure there are ways to stop this too. This is what i think. Posted by Eternal Blue on 02:06:2002 06:52 PM: quote: Originally posted by Silent Storm All this stuff you say about IM owing Cable is not true. This tactic that ya'll are talking about a dude try to do it to me when i played cable. And guess what, i whipped his ass. All a cable player has to do sj after IM comes down and throw a hk grenade to stop him from jumping up and lp psimitars. Or he could keep sj and shooting lp viper beams to make sure he does get that stuff started. Duhhhhhhh. So don't go telling people this tactic, and get their asses blasted, even though it might work against some people, but not against the good Cable players. I'm sure there are ways to stop this too. This is what i think. Its so easy to own Cables that just sj., fierce xx grenade. Its so predictable. And the funny thing is, thats half of Cable's gameplan. All IM has to do, as I said before, is just alter his gameplan slightly. For example, you know Cable is going to sj. and shoot fierce, so dash forward and try to tag Cable with Upfierce. Or maybe just normal jump, and trick Cable into sj'ing, then wave dash, and sj under Cable and try to throw him or you can combo him, or maybe just build free meter by doing up fierce xx AD xx upfierce and even Cable blocks, its safe. Also, just stay on the ground, and as Cable is falling sj quickly, and start your SB pattern again. Cable is predictable and more importantly, he cannot defend against low attacks right under him and he cannot defend attacks right on top in the air. This is perfect for IM because he has his up+fierce and his down+fierce. Posted by Silent Storm II on 02:06:2002 07:16 PM: quote: Originally posted by Eternal Blue Its so easy to own Cables that just sj., fierce xx grenade. Its so predictable. And the funny thing is, thats half of Cable's gameplan. All IM has to do, as I said before, is just alter his gameplan slightly. For example, you know Cable is going to sj. and shoot fierce, so dash forward and try to tag Cable with Upfierce. Or maybe just normal jump, and trick Cable into sj'ing, then wave dash, and sj under Cable and try to throw him or you can combo him, or maybe just build free meter by doing up fierce xx AD xx upfierce and even Cable blocks, its safe. Also, just stay on the ground, and as Cable is falling sj quickly, and start your SB pattern again. Cable is predictable and more importantly, he cannot defend against low attacks right under him and he cannot defend attacks right on top in the air. This is perfect for IM because he has his up+fierce and his down+fierce. Ok if you say so, but im warning you, don't keep doing that. The same way you see cable doing the same thing, That person your playing can see you doing the same thing. Cable has ways of coutering just like IM does. You can keep doing it, but you better be cautious about it, or your ass will gey blasted. Posted by antinewbies182 on 02:06:2002 07:22 PM: The problem is that IM have a lot of delay in almost are his moves . Cable have a chance to AHVB . Is a good idea keep changing the tactic ; sometime keep away , and some little time close range trying infinite when landing after smart bombs or whatever. Posted by IcarusDownworks on 02:06:2002 07:58 PM: Try to lure Cable into AHVB's by doing ground unibeams. Chances are the Cable player won't know the recovery is too fast unless he plays a lot of IMs. Posted by loki on 02:06:2002 08:06 PM: umm... IM can be ok against cable, but not against ezpierienced and/or really well played cabbles, unless your IM is alot better than their cable. i think Top Notch is right, infact i know BH assist is all over this tactic; IM superjumps and gets hit with BH assist before he can throw the bombs. Cable starts covering him with viper beams, and uses BH assist to keep IM from getting upper screen advantage -----or----- IM sj's and blocks BH assist, Cable sj's and viper beams IM. when IM Exits blockstun he is falling and cable is at the apex of his canceled SJ. Cable falls after and cover IM with viper beams. then traps when he lands. -----or------ IM fakes a sj and Cable miss jumps. IM waits to sj when Cable falls, but cable does a grenade and when IM sj's it hits him and he is AHVB'd ---or---- he blocks it, cable lands and call BH assist and begins to trap IM. i know i haven't covered all angles, but from those it seems that most Cables have what it takes to get around that strategy. soi what else do you do to get aound a good(or great ) cable?? joe tomasine Posted by margalis on 02:06:2002 08:16 PM: quote: Originally posted by Silent Storm All this stuff you say about IM owing Cable is not true. This tactic that ya'll are talking about a dude try to do it to me when i played cable. And guess what, i whipped his ass. All a cable player has to do sj after IM comes down and throw a hk grenade to stop him from jumping up and lp psimitars. Or he could keep sj and shooting lp viper beams to make sure he does get that stuff started. Duhhhhhhh. So don't go telling people this tactic, and get their asses blasted, even though it might work against some people, but not against the good Cable players. I'm sure there are ways to stop this too. This is what i think. Cable can't super jump as Iron Man comes down, because Cable is stuck blocking smart bombs. The point is, once IM has the height advantage he can keep it for a while. You force them to block smart bombs, as they block you jump up again. If Cable is able to super jump at the exact same time IM is, IM still has options. And Cable can't SJ at exactly the same time unless you get too predictable. Posted by margalis on 02:06:2002 08:21 PM: quote: Originally posted by loki i know i haven't covered all angles, but from those it seems that most Cables have what it takes to get around that strategy. soi what else do you do to get aound a good(or great ) cable?? joe tomasine Um...basically EVERY tactic you mentioned was a blackheart tactic and had nothing to do with cable at all. The fact is, Blackheart is good againt super jump and flying runaway. Good againt IM runaway, good against Dhalsim runaway, good against Storm runaway, etc. That has NOTHING to do with Cable at all. You say that a "good or great" Cable can get around these tactics, but all you are REALLY saying is that ANYONE with Blackheart can get around these tactics. Question is, how often are Cable and BH on the same team? Does BH just automatically come with Cable for free? So, Blackheart helper is a good counter-choice to runaway...yay... Posted by EBX on 02:06:2002 09:27 PM: Here's a trick I developed in my head right now. Try this: When you get an opportunity, do sj. fierce xx AD back/up xx fierce xx far Smart Bombs, and while they're slowly decending, press back so you land near the opposite corner, than do a c. fierce to release a rocket, and I think the rocket should keep the opponent in blockstun, giving you enough time to sj. up again, into fierce xx AD up/back xx fierce xx Smart Bombs again, and trapping them. Also, about the BH issue, sure BH does well against any sort of runaway, but I believe that IM can AD past old Blackie. Also, because Cable will superjump after BH, there is a possibility that after IM gets 3 meters, he could kill BH. Let's say IM remains on the ground, then a Proton Cannon xx HVB xx SOB could kill him i think. Anyway, BH is a risk to have on your team, because he gets OWNED by many characters, he cant chip, he's a horrible come back character...etc. He's a big liability. He's probably the worst AA to play as if he doesn't a have an assist. At least CapCom, Cammy and Cyke are good alone. Posted by randomplayerx on 02:07:2002 05:06 AM: ok so maybe IM owns cable one on one. (I think his slow ass would get ahvb'd sooner or later but I don't play against IM much) But this is a team game, and almost everyone who plays cable is going to have at least one anti air assist on his team, which should completely shut down the iron one. Just my thoughts on the matter. Posted by Eternal Blue on 02:07:2002 05:26 AM: quote: Originally posted by randomplayerx ok so maybe IM owns cable one on one. (I think his slow ass would get ahvb'd sooner or later but I don't play against IM much) But this is a team game, and almost everyone who plays cable is going to have at least one anti air assist on his team, which should completely shut down the iron one. Just my thoughts on the matter. Just to let u know, Cammy AAA and Ken AAA dont hurt IM runaway much. CapCom AAA hurts him somewhat if he is under him directly. Cyke AAA obviously does not do much (optic bullet fluke, maybe). As I said, BH AAA is only one that gives him mucho problems. Posted by Gen2000 on 02:07:2002 05:37 AM: Good post. Just like to mention.. quote: c. short, c. short, c. rh xx jab unibeam This little meter combo is good and bad, it works on some character, but some can jump between the gap of the cr.hk and lp unibeam and counter in some shape or form. Posted by TS on 02:07:2002 06:07 AM: quote: Originally posted by MadHatter couldnt cable just sj with IM then viper beam him before the first hp? Can't he just do the same thing to Storm? (no) Just for the record...when people used to talk about IM/WM being good against Cable, this is what they meant...it had nothing to do with the infinite. They were talking about IM(WM)/Doom or IM(WM)/Sent or something like that, to keep Cable blocking all day while they SJd/Flew/Air Dashed/whatever and dropped Smart Bombs. Posted by mixup on 02:07:2002 08:48 AM: The funny thing about most people posting about how their elite cable knowledge owns Ironman....whew.....is, that they say they never fight good ironmans, he's annoying guys, just solid all around. Sooner than later he will be more common. Posted by Eternal Blue on 02:07:2002 03:25 PM: About the c. short, c. short, c. rh xx jab Unibeam, I think that if the opponent does jump, then you may be in trouble. But you don't do the jab Unibeam. Could you explain what characters can avoid the c. rh? I'm just curious. Could these same characters escape the c. strong, or the s. forward (if done in the same combo)? This brings me to something else. I know how some people said that Cable can jump and shoot fierce, while the counter argument was that once IM gains the upper ground, he will maintain the dominance. So, here's something useful. IM can do something like dash in c. short, c. strong, c. rh + beam assist or Doom AAA xx Super Jump cancel into a smart bomb pattern. Not only will this put Cable in enough block stun so that you can indeed gain the higher ground and start the dominance, but chances are that the beam assist (Cable-A in my case) will knock CapCom out of his AAA (could someone clarify this), knock Doom AAA, and some other assists. Also, Doom AAA will neutralize Cammy AAA and will beat CapCom AAA. Oh, I forgot, Cable-A would also hit BH AAA as he's coming out. So, then that wouldn't be a problem (at least not for starting the SB game). So, I think this is good news if you're wondering how to gain the upper ground, or at least be able to start the SB pattern without doing more complex stuff like faking sj's and AD'ing under Cable to hit with up+fierce. PS. Can IM super jump cancel from the c. rh? What about the s. fierce? Posted by teammember001 on 02:07:2002 03:53 PM: Cable can fight this in the same way he fights a runaway Storm. Wait for when the opp is coming down, if he's coming close, meke him block the assist and do sj HP grenade or whatever to regain teh control. If he's coming far away, make him block a j back HP, then VB(If you had an horizontal assist, specially Spiral, you can ock them with it). So it will go j back HP, VB, assist comes, 4 ground HPs, VB, assist comes again(that's Duc's cable/spiral trap, that killed Ricky's runaway Storm and started making Storm offensive against Cable). If you have Comm, wavedash call him and go to whatever position you like while IM deal with it, regaining the control. Runaway is now used mostly to kill time, if you don't have the lead you might eat more chip then you can apply. Plus, if you do one mistake, you're dead. If cable does one mistake, you usually can't reach him in time. The IMs that deal better with Cable, like Wong and Combofien, prefer to rushdown. Like iceman said, he plays a lot like Doom(when running away) and Doom usually loses to cable when trying to do that. Posted by Eternal Blue on 02:07:2002 04:37 PM: quote: Originally posted by teammember001 Like iceman said, he plays a lot like Doom(when running away) and Doom usually loses to cable when trying to do that. No. IM like Doom beats Cable. Posted by UCRollerblader on 02:07:2002 08:08 PM: I have still yet to see an Iron man that just dominates cable and the people I play against play good iron mans. Iron man doesn't have storms runaway or rushdown. His rushdown is ok, but not magneto quality. His ground infinite is what gets the win though. I have since seen the millions of ways that iron man sets up that damn infinite by himself and thats the only thing I fear. Cable should be super jumping on reaction to Iron man's super jumping or wave dashing underneath anyways. And cable is going to have either an AAA or a trap assist to help him out so I still fail to see how Iron man owns cable. I would say I like spiral more then any other character right now. Just so damn fun to use and you can't kill someone in one practical combo which i like. i'll finish the post later.. I got shit to do. Posted by Nun on 02:08:2002 02:50 PM: Hellow to all american players i did not want to use this website but i really liked this threat and some of the comments made were really interesting. I just liked to give my opinion on the whole issue of ironman vs cable. TO ANSWER SOMEBODY'S QUESTION ABOUT SUPERJUMP CANCELING HIS CROUNCHING HK: the answer is yes. I use it in the corner where you can follow the superjump canceling with lp, dash forward lp, uHP, infinite. Or you can just combo it into pc. The reason why i use it is to finish infinite in pc easier using lp, c.lp, into pc. What you can do is do the infinite up to 40 hits or so, s.hp, c.hk, superjump cancel, lp, dash forward lp, uHP, standing hp, into pc or standing lp, c.lp, into pc. ironman vs cable: Ironman does not own cable. In fact if cable is played smart with a good anti air assist (cyc) in this case and a good projectile assist behind him (storm, sent, spiral). Cable can become a good ironman stopper and give him any chance to do any thing. Ironman's run away is not as great as storm's as somebody else mentioned. He can superjump around a little bit, throwing acouple smart bombs, doing a couple hp, etc but you think you can beat a good cable like that with that strategy? NO. cable is extreamly dangoures speically if cable jumps and superjumps around alot. Ironman's rushdown is good but it is not much reliable. You can not keep on triangle jumping like you would with magneto. Ironman is a character that unless you know what you are doing you can not WIN. you have to know when to attack and when to just stand back and block. Believe it or not, most ironman's become predictable very quickly. But, ironman can defeat cable, only if played well. Ironman alone can not beat cable very easily but if he has doom on his side there is a very solid chance that he might win. It all comes down to how you play ironman. It is not like ironman owns cable because that is not true. Cable has the advantage in this case but if ironman is played well, both rushdown and run away there is a good chance that he can beat cable. I recommand you to watch some Mitsu vs Neese that are some where on the internet. Mitsu is an other good ironman player who can use ironman better than probably White. Neese is a very good cable,storm,cyc player. the match is old but it is a good example how ironman can be misrable when facing a good cable with good assists behind it. ` Posted by Gen2000 on 02:08:2002 05:49 PM: Wow, this thread most have been really important for nun to make an account and post, heh. Posted by Eternal Blue on 02:08:2002 06:05 PM: quote: Originally posted by Gen2000 Wow, this thread most have been really important for nun to make an account and post, heh. LOL...yeah. I didn't wanna post cause I didn't want my nick to appear as the last poster. Nun should post again, so this thread gets more recognition. Anyway, I played a lot of IM/Cable/Cammy matches against Cable/Sent/CapCom yesterday. First, my machine is LVL4 damage, so the matches really mean nothing, since CapCom AAA takes 40% damage on normal strength characters, and Cable's AHVB does around 70-85% damage on most. So, I noticed some things, first, if Cable gets underneath you with CapCom AAA, you're going to have some trouble, but I also noticed some good things. If you put yourself in the corner, then when you sj, CapCom AAA will miss you if you're right in the edge of the screen. At least thats what I noticed the one time it happened. While Cable's sj'ing with me and and doing VB's is an annoyance, there's ways to get around that. Okay, so we can all agree that you should NEVER do ANYTHING if you sj. and Cable is on the same horizontal plain. Right. So, question is, how do you gain a good height advantage and avoid CapCom also. Well, here's some tips. 1) Keep sj'ing, maybe 2-3 times, and from then on, sj, dash back down, land, and nail CapCom with a jab Unibeam, and you will not get hurt by Cable. This is one of the HUGE advantages has over Cable, his Air Dash. While once Cable has commited to a sj, he can't get down as fast as IM. IM can sj, then dash down quickly. While this trick can be AHVB'ed, its highly unlikely if you do it in spurts (read: dont get predictable). Now, since Cable LOVES to sj with you, you can also normal jump, and bait him into sj'ing. Basically, a BIG portion of your game will be to bait him into sj'ing and nailing the assists BIT by BIT....until he dies, or you have a chance to snap the hurt assist in and lose maybe 50%-60% life from jab unibeams. 2) Now, I mentioned big part is to bait Cable into sj'ing. Okay, now here's the second big part of your game. After's you've jab Unibeamed the assist (not Sent, he has SA), you have to position yourself under Cable. When he gets near the ground, do your launcher, it will outprioritize all his jumpins (mainly, his only jumpin...rh). If he blocks, cancel into Jab Unibeam and you're safe. If he doesn't you can go into his 50-70% air combo (launch, sj(short, up+fierce, up+rh, AD UF xx up+fierce, up+rh xx flight xx up+fierce, up+rh xx throw (if you're in corner))...or better yet, you can go into his infinite. I'll type later...I have to do some work now. Later, and thanks for postin Nun, we all appreciate advice from the top Japanese players. Posted by Who on 02:08:2002 10:15 PM: Interesting concept on the runaway IM. IMO if a Cable player has Commando it should be a lot easier to catch IM. The reason being that it depends on the positioning of the smart bombs. if you do it far or normal Cable can wave dash under them. If you do it short (closer to yourself) he can stay full screen and SJ. Commando comes itno play because after the wave dash Cable can assist Commando and whether it hits you or block it doesn't matter. It still forces you to come down. Also you should learn the infinite, not only to use up time but to build meter as well. Posted by teammember001 on 02:09:2002 05:09 PM: quote: Originally posted by Eternal Blue No. IM like Doom beats Cable. Try to see any vid of any tourney on the net and you'll see that you're wrong. I have like 15 Doom vs Cable vids and Doom got the advantage at only 1 of them. Also, hear Nun. he knows what he's talking about Posted by IMMagDoom on 02:12:2002 04:38 AM: Cable can stop IM If Cable can anticipate IM's sj. then his fp hunshot can stop IM's sj much in the same way that Doom's pistol can limit a players movement, but Cable must have an effective assist in order to cover him. Posted by DeathFromAbove on 02:12:2002 06:08 AM: Quick tip: If you wavedash under smartbombs and SJ, IM is able to block/attack before you get up to him. And his SJ.LK beats pretty much anything Cable can attack with on the way up. See, he's not exactly like Doom. -DFA Posted by IMMagDoom on 02:12:2002 05:30 PM: My bad Your right on that one, my bad. But I never said he was exactly like Doom, just that his fp works a lot like it. What you said works only if you are under the assumption that Cable does not have a good AAA assist. Posted by yoshi2k2 on 02:12:2002 06:55 PM: You can't do all that shit if cable is running his ass off and has capcom or cammy's anti-air Posted by Eternal Blue on 02:12:2002 09:18 PM: quote: Originally posted by yoshi2k2 You can't do all that shit if cable is running his ass off and has capcom or cammy's anti-air Yeah you can. Cammy doesn't pose much of a problem, but CapCom can be a pain in the ass. Runaway Cable is so weak, its not even funny. He gets air-thrown, setup for huge combos, and other shit. CABLE RUNAWAY = WEAK. All times are GMT. The time now is 12:27 AM. Show all 40 posts from this thread on one page Powered by: vBulletin Version 2.2.4 Copyright © Jelsoft Enterprises Limited 2000, 2001.